scoob wilL not Start

[Broxi]

Ok, i have tried just about everything now, and am stumped. with the exception that it could be a Wiring loom fault.

I got my engine and fitted it, but it will not Fire up.

i tow started it, but it would not rev above 3000 rpm.

i have checked the timing several times, its spot on.

i have changed crank and cam sensor's

I have done a compression test and have 135 PSI on all 4 cylinders

i stripped the wiring under the inlet amnnifold and examined their is no brakes, also done a continuity test on all of those wires.

i have removed the FSE and put back the Std Fuel Pressure Regulator

i have tried a working ecu.

have checked and have a Spark at all 4 plugs.

i have also checked wsing Mr H's car the connection of injector and coil pack wires.

I do not know what to do next.

However, when i connect the ecu diagnostic wires, the ecu light goes OUT and the car does NOT go through the diagnostic test of sensors etc. as you cannot hear the fan spin, or any sensor/relay clicking.

any ideas?

Derek

[Broxi]

plugs on off side are getting Soaked, their is deff a spark.

i have also gone back and re- checked the Timing.

here is a pic of the mark's ligned up.

the crank one, i have had to highlight with a white mark as it was Not clear, but its spot on.

I would apreciate any suggestions.

Derek

[gavo]

Derek dont know if this will help or not but have just stripped mine down and when i took the cambelt of made a mental note of how the timing marks was set and my cams were set so the timing marks faced up ie. bottom cam had the timing mark at the top and so did the top cam so all four were identical.Hope this helps mate.

[Broxi]

Hi thanks for that, I know the timing is not the issue.

if you look in my first pic you will see, the cams have a single mark at the top, that lines u with the notch in the cover.

the cam pulleys have a single mark and two marks, when the single marks are correctly aligned, the two marks on each inlet and exhaust cam should align.

I only put the pics, up as it aprars from the problem it could have been timing, which i know its not.

I believe the Injectors could be F*****

I have removed the plugs from the injectors on the Passenger side and removed the pipe to the throttle body. (Where the tmic would connect)

I sprayed easy start in their and it will sort of run on easy start, with the two injectors disconnected. connect them and it wont fire.

[tiny]

could it be that the two looms are slightly different meaning that maybe 2 connections are in the wrong place?

have you got your injectors from your old engine or maybe you could borrow mr H`s to see if they work?

[Broxi]

Hi,

I am using my loom and all of my sensors, so id say no. I have checked the other engine, loom, with the exception of the wiring for the 5th injector the other loom is identical the other loom does not have the wires for a 5th injector.

[tiny]

could i tbe related to the wiring for the 5th injector then as maybe that could be what is causing your problems or like you say it could be knackered/blocked injectors

[Neil G]

Hi thanks for that, I know the timing is not the issue.

if you look in my first pic you will see, the cams have a single mark at the top, that lines u with the notch in the cover.

the cam pulleys have a single mark and two marks, when the single marks are correctly aligned, the two marks on each inlet and exhaust cam should align.

I only put the pics, up as it aprars from the problem it could have been timing, which i know its not.

I believe the Injectors could be F*****

I have removed the plugs from the injectors on the Passenger side and removed the pipe to the throttle body. (Where the tmic would connect)

I sprayed easy start in their and it will sort of run on easy start, with the two injectors disconnected. connect them and it wont fire.

Sounds like you could well be on the right tracks Derek

I did an engine swap a few years ago on a 205gti and that wouldn't start at all....checked everything over lots of times but still had no joy.

Ended up getting a friend from a local garage to come and help us out....turned out to be blocked/****ed injector/injector rail. Swapped the rails over and it started first time.

[Broxi]

Cool, i do believe its injectors.

I got some Yellow 1999 440 cc Injectors to use, but they are different and do not fit the rails.

Derek

[Agent Smith]

NICE!!!!.........hope your mission is accomplished,with the injectors boss........:character0009:

[Olly P]

Where are you at now then Derek?
Do you have some other injectors you could try?
I don't know if this has been mentioned but are the coils on the right plugs?
Oh and I can't see any pics, which would be useful.
If you could write a simple list of the things you have checked that you are confident are ok, and we can go from there.

However, when i connect the ecu diagnostic wires, the ecu light goes OUT and the car does NOT go through the diagnostic test of sensors etc. as you cannot hear the fan spin, or any sensor/relay clicking.


I think there may be an answer in there somewhere.
Can you get your existing injectors flow tested?

[Broxi]

Ok Will do, I am off out now, so will do the list in a Bit.

i am waiting on some injectors from Rednick.

The coil pack wires are right, the wiring is done so one wire is longer then the other, and the front coil pack wire also has a White tab on the wiring to denote which is front and back.

The Injector wires are the Same.

I have changed the Inlet Manifold to a std WRX one without the 5th Injector, and used the STD WRX wiring too.

she will start with the two injector wires on the Passenger side disconnected and the intercooler pipe disconnected from the Throttle Body.

once started i can connect the two injectors and it will run for a few mins.

I have got a small video clip i done on my mobile of it when i get it running.

not sure if the format is compatable with the forum so you may need to download it.

Derek

[Olly P]

It says I don't have the appropriate permissions to download the file........whatever that means, lol.

[bob]

http://www.bob.szhosting.net/Video/video-0004.mp4

Try this Olly...

[Broxi]

Thanks bob.

Olly can you see the pics on the first page of the cam timing?

I have done a compression check and all 4 are showing 135 PSI

It has been suggested tat i have got Bent Valves as i am using my heads. I did not think its possible, as the compression was within the specified range in the workshop Manual.

if the valve's were bent then surely they would not close and i would have no compression on that cylinder.

I have also thought today, what if some of the Hydraulic lifters did not pump up, and those valves are not lifting.

obviously the valve would open slightly.

Personally I think it is Fueling as the two plugs on the passenger side keep getting soaked.

[Olly P]

Hmmmmm, if you had a slightly bent inlet valve and a sticking injector, that could explain why it would fire for a bit with ez start or a rolling start.
By getting the pistons moving by some other means you might be getting enough fuel moving to get a partial burn but its eventually being overwhelmed by the amount.
Any half decent garage should have a flow tester and should be able to tell you if they're ok.
But I would be worried why the check connectors aren't working.

[bob]

Even with a bend valve I would have thought the engine would start on just the other 3..cyl..A compresion test shows compression so this itself should be enough to at least kick the thing over.. Just going to Tiley's now will have a chat with Dave see what he thinks...

Have a nice chat with Dave? He is a good lad and will always try to help out us scoob owners when he can. So if you are sure the cams are in the right place left to left as sat in car and right to right inlet and exhaust right places and cam sprockets all righ places.
Still flooding on one side? Have you tried swapping injectors and seeing if the other side them becomes flooded?
Dave has given me a pair of grey top injectors. Perhaps a swap of injectors will help things out..

You Have PM.

[Broxi]

Hi all,

Bob got me a couple of injectors from Tilleys taday, i Fitted them, and its not firing at all now.

checked, and their is still a spark.

I have also noticed, No3 is creating a Flashback around the coil pack, so i changed the coil Pack, while it was out i checked the plug was done up and it is, put on the other coil pack, and it is Still flashing around the coil pack.

No idea what it is now.

Mr H has agreed to let me try his ECU tomorrow to see what happens

Its really annoying now.

[Broxi]

Ok, ecu reset works on STD ecu only.
Bob can also confirm this.

I double checked again Last Night. It is NOT possible to put the cams into the wrong head.
it is possible however to mix the inlet and exhaust cams.

I guess thats my next step.
I will start with the Passenger side as thats most likly where its wrong, as thats where it floods.

Derek

[bob]

Ok, ecu reset works on STD ecu only.
Bob can also confirm this.

I double checked again Last Night. It is NOT possible to put the cams into the wrong head.
it is possible however to mix the inlet and exhaust cams.

I guess thats my next step.
I will start with the Passenger side as thats most likly where its wrong, as thats where it floods.

Derek

As Dave said M8 even he has mixed the cams and he builds engines every day. Its always worth checking.
Does 2 of your cam sprockets have the metal bits on the inside of the sprocket for the cam timing sensor or is it just the one? Another thing to check...make sure the right sprocket matches with cams and sensors...Clutching at straws now....

[Broxi]

ok took the rocker covers off the check Cams are in the right place, as inlet and exhaust could have been Wrong.

The Cams were in Right. but when i pulled the rocker cover off, i had loads of oily petrol pour out. and the head is all milky white inside.

So its heads off. Took the inlet manifold back off. bearing in mind it was last night that i last tried to start the car, the head on one inlet on the passenger side was full of Petrol.

So maybee 1 bent valve after all.?

[Broxi]

Ok, its not the valves, its human ERROR.

seems like as bob said its down to the Cams.

as you know i have had it running on the drivers side, but not the passenger side, which suggests the problem is on the passenger side of the engine.
Wrong.
As you know i checked the cams on the passenger side, they were right.

I took the passenger head off, today, removed and checked all they valves, they are spot on.

so time to remove the drivers side.

Took the rocker cover off, low and behold what do i see, at the top. R2EX (Right Exhaust) on the Right Inlet. and the R2IN was on the EXhaust.

very strange as it run on that bank.

the exhaust headers were full of petrol as is the oil.

So i recon its going to be up and running in the week.

WOOhhhoooo

[elowarr]

Glad to hear that Derek you must be piffed right off by now.

[Broxi]

I am but also relieved to have found the cause.

[bob]

Good news then Derrek...:cool: Don't worry your not the only one to do this, its been done many times before..thats why I mentioned it...:hysterical:
Hope to see you on the road real soon...:smile:

[Broxi]

I Know, seen Gavo's post symptoms were Identicle, so i told him, and he done the Same, on the Drivers side which is very Strange.

He hopes to have his running today, now he has sorted his problem.

tried to phone you yesterday to let you know, i have tried, and i cannot get the left cams to fit the right head, also the left inlet does not swap with the left Exhaust, without forcing it in. only the right one's go in easy.

which is why when i tested the cams in the left head it did not seem possible.

Derek

[bob]

Thought Gavo's had oil coming from crank seal? or did the engine pressure not being right, because of cams, blow the seal?

[Broxi]

no idea, I sent him P.m and called Ed, they checked, and he had mixed up the same two cams as i did.

Hopefully he has got it all up and running now.

Derek

[Torpoint1]

Gavos back up and running now

[Broxi]

Yep he let me know earlier, the cams was the problem with his.

[Agent Smith]

oil feed pipe now a little prob.....

[Mrs Scoobtastic]

its getting there though

[bob]

Any news on the motor Derek...

[Broxi]

yup, took the heads, from the new engine in to be checked and they were warped, so having them lightly skimmed, should be ready to collect tomorrow afternoon, so weather permitting i will make a start first thing on Wednesday.

[bob]

Must be costing a few bob in gaskets...:sad-smiley-046: Do hope its on the road by the weekend M8...:smile:

[Broxi]

yup, £65 a time.

glad its not Genuils Subaru ones, £256+vat what stanburys @ Dulverton Quoted me.

[Broxi]

All up and running. yeeeeha

Just need to get hold of another water pipe from the top of the Turbo to the Header Tank.

Had it ticking over for a few hours, putting all the interior back in, where i removed it looking for a wiring fault that was not their.

cant wait to take her out.

[bob]

:bananarock: :bananarock: :bananarock: :party0006: :party0006: :party0006: :bananarock: :bananarock: :bananarock:

[Broxi]

when its cold tickover is up and down all over the place, it hessitates when driving. for some reason, when i came back from a 5 min drive, it kept stalling.

i did not take it above 50 but it felt like it was slugish.

Going to try it again tomorrow.

[surfer boy]

Someone on Scoobynet this week described similar symptoms with an iffy Lambda sensor?
http://bbs.scoobynet.co.uk/showthread.php?t=511232

Still at least it's running.

[Broxi]

can test the Lamba as the Apexi has the ability to turn it off.

i went over all the pipes ensuring they were right, a few times, but will have another look in the morning.

Thanks
Derek

[tiny]

sounds to me like lambda as well

got to get one for mine at some point, does it stall on full lock etc?